Jobs....

Hey folks unemployed or know anyone unemployed? Like being in the great outdoors, like to travel and willing to relocate a few times?...there are opening I'm sure right here in Utah.

http://www.takeourjobs.org/

http://news.yahoo.com/s/ap/20100624/ap_on_en_tv/us_immigration_take_our_jobs#

proutdoors wrote:

Hmmmm why the rolling eyes Pro? Why wouldn't unemployed Americans find these jobs attractive???...hey your a working American supporting your family.. earning a wage...making a living...it's a job right? Pro are you saying with the rolling eyes these types of jobs aren't worthy and are not important to Americans to have. Guess big fella ya lost me or maybe I'm missing something here but hey that's okay.

So who should be working these types of jobs? .

Americans...but what Americans???? Ahhhh yes I know (the frick'n genius that I am)....why not the almost 'free' labor force in detention centers, jails and prisons...Oh then you have to pay the wages of the guards watching these folks...the cost of transportation /upkeep of the vehicles, food costs, medical care for the ones who get hurt...can't have folks from detention centers, jails and prisons not eating and not getting medical attention now can we.

k2muskie wrote:

proutdoors wrote:

Hmmmm why the rolling eyes Pro? Why wouldn't unemployed Americans find these jobs attractive???...hey your a working American supporting your family.. earning a wage...making a living...it's a job right? Pro are you saying with the rolling eyes these types of jobs aren't worthy and are not important to Americans to have. Guess big fella ya lost me or maybe I'm missing something here but hey that's okay.

So who should be working these types of jobs? .

Americans...but what Americans???? Ahhhh yes I know (the frick'n genius that I am)....why not the almost 'free' labor force in detention centers, jails and prisons...Oh then you have to pay the wages of the guards watching these folks...the cost of transportation /upkeep of the vehicles, food costs, medical care for the ones who get hurt...can't have folks from detention centers, jails and prisons not eating and not getting medical attention now can we.

Come on k2, you're smarter than this. Why would Americans who get more on welfare take these jobs? What you, and MOST progressives miss is the hidden costs of ILLEGAL immigrant work forces. This drives down wages across all sectors, and keeps entry level people out of these jobs. If YOU advocate tightening up welfare requirements, getting RID of the minimum wage, and enforce our borders, we can talk. Until then this is just a political ploy meant to justify ILLEGAL immigrants being here and costing not only jobs, but many other social ills as well. A nation must have and ENFORCE laws in order to be free.

Pro we'll agree to disagree on this to a point...So are you saying there no abled bodied Americans is doing the same exact thing you bring out about costs, social ills, and Illegal Immigrants. Can you qualify with facts the percentage of illegal Immigrants vs Americans on hidden costs and social ills. Are you saying every illegal immigrant is a cost and social ill? Please provide 'objectve' not subjective facts on this and i'd like the comparision of illegal immigrants vs Americans...

But come on... working in the fields...again there are able body Americans that could do this work. Why don't Americans want these types of jobs especially if they're not employed, why aren't Americans protesting this and flocking to these jobs...hey it's work. The point of this thread is Americans need to take up this challenge and take these Jobs.

Folks like yourself IMHO only see one side and not the entire picture including lumping all into one. If one can work then get your arse out and start working these types of jobs and get off welfare get off unemployment...I agree with you cut welfare and unemployment compensation and make AMERICANS work these types of jobs as farm laborers and see what happens then....Pro what do you think would really happen if we cut welfare and unemployment and made Americans work as laborers in fields and other types of jobs like in slaughter houses, maids, service industry (fast food), landscaping, even labor in the building industry...what would happen???

Ah my Carnac prediction is cost of everything would sky-rocket as then you have all the compensation packages like, retirement, health care, vacation, 401K, sick time, family sick, etc, etc, etc...who do you think pays for this...the Company.

So yep send all the Illegal Immigrants packing...their only crime being is they're here illegally but work hard.

Americans will cut their nose off to spite their face...and bottom line are LAZY, LAZY, LAZY......so drive the $$$$$$$$$$$$$$ of everything through the roof so we don't have illegal immigrants.

God Bless America and true red, white, blue Americans all others here illegally are hidden costs, create social ills and the only ones to place a burden on the US of A taxpayer. No American is a doing any of this or would dare do this...because they'll take the jobs of illegals back so there will be no hidden costs, social ills, or burdens...as their won't be any illegal immigrants working American jobs and Americans won't mind paying $10 for a head of lettuce, fruit, $20 a lb for any type of meat...as we finally will cure this countries problems...every American of working age is gainfully employed working hard and plain ole WORKING!!! Wahoooooo and no more welfare, unemployment and other social ills every illegal immigrant has plagued this country with....Wahoooooooooooooooooooooooooo

K2, both Pro and I come from agricultural backgrounds, and we've both seen the first-hand effects and restructuring in the industry that has taken place, partially as a result of illegal workers.

You're right, of course, illegal immigrants perform cut-rate agricultural work, which keeps the costs down of the products they help produce. Without these people doing the work, the employers would need to raise wages and pay more attention to labor conditions and government requirements. Prices would increase significantly for certain products, but I doubt we would see them "skyrocket." Suddenly removing these people from the workforce would cause a significant disruption to an economy and a labor force that has become accustomed to them being there. Some farmers might go out of business; we'd see significantly more imports of these items from, say, Mexico; new agricultural niches would arise; but eventually, it would all balance out in one way or another.

I could argue this issue from any of a half dozen angles, but just to pick an unusual one (for here, anyway) that hasn't been discussed...

From a politically liberal, progressive, social point of view, illegal aliens amount to a highly exploited worker class. The government, over the past 75 years, has put into place a good deal of safeguards to protect workers: safety standards, retirement benefits, public education, labor laws, wage laws, unemployment insurance, and recently, health care. Illegal migrant agricultural workers are cheap to hire because records aren't kept and government rules are ignored.

Just an anecdote, but it exemplifies a larger problem: I have a next-door neighbor who is a rather well-off, retired attorney who is rather fond of placing democratic political signs on his front lawn. He has hired, for about three or four bucks and hour, an older, illegal immigrant worker, whom he refers to as "My Mexican." "My [his] Mexican" mows the lawn twice per week, trims the bushes, plants the flowers, rakes the leaves, washes the windows, shovels snow, cleans the car and does most anything else that he's ordered to do. "My Mexican," since he can't drive and doesn't own a car, sometimes unrolls a sleeping bag in the empty lot next to my neighbors' house where he spends the night. On occasion, my neighbor has volunteered to let me use "My Mexican" to do chores around my house, but I've always declined.

Again, from a politically liberal point of view, these illegal, migrant workers have formed a worker class of untouchables that have fallen between the cracks and that exist in that substandard, second-class netherworld that our, supposedly, socially responsible society has deemed unfit for American citizens. So what is the liberal answer to this problem? A guest worker program, among others. But this post has already gotten too long, so we'll leave the problems associated with that one alone.

modern day slavery

Argh...I had a great post and my laptop battery died...and as you know you're orginial post will never be recaptured or the same.

Anyhoo...for illegal immigrants the government needs to do something better. These folks I'd wager a vast majority are hard working, law abiding (except for being illegal to America)decent folks basically like you and me and just want to make a living and provide for their families. If it's jobs Americans find beneath them to do so be it. Worker visas should be a priority for this country along with citizenship.

Again Americans did this to themselves with illegal immigrants as basically I've read in Pete's post. Americans for the most part are spoiled and want to live the good life and start out in a job making 75+ grand a year with no training. Wishfull think'n. Again get off your ass and quit blaming illegal immigrants for your own short comings.

Here's something that just recently happened to me.

My sister who I love dearly happened to see a picture of my daughter and her boyfriend on Facebook. Well, my daughters boy friend is Hispanic and an American...my sister doesn't know squat about him but she started yelling and screaming at me on the phone...with words that would make the saltest merchant marine blush...but here's something I know you'd understand she said....he's F**K'n Mexican and they've taken American Jobs. Oh well and the conversation ended.

Now how many of us every day...someone whose not white and/or speaks with broken English do we say to ourselves...they're illegal. Shame on me and you if me and you think this way...shame on all of us. Judge one as to the content of their character and not the color of their skin or broken English...

If illegal immigrants again only crime being they're illegal the government needs to belly up to the bar and provide work visas and eventually citizenship if these folks desire to live in America.

Many say President Regan was the best President this country ever had...but yet in 1986 he granted amnesty for over 2+million illegal immigrants. But no one talks about that factoid. So what is different today...nothing IMHO...we as Americans can't have our cake and eat it too when it comes to illegal immigrants...either do something about your own short comings get skilled or STFU and look at what you can control in your life and your families life and quit rationalizing your failings on someone else...who just happens to maybe work harder than you and will take a job you'd never take...

Oh Pro...didn't you ever hear or watch Johnny Carson in his wizard hat and his Carnac preditions...Carnac is nothing more than someone prediction.

Love ya all...God Bless America and the hard working illegal immigrants who give us the services/products we enjoy every day...too bad many folks have blinders on.

The Hispanic immigrants that I've known have, for the most part, been good, decent people who have come here to work hard in order to make theirs and their family's lives better. I admire them for that, and have a great deal of respect for them and their motives.

On the other hand, due to their huge numbers — tens of millions — it sort of overwhelms the whole melting pot process of immigrant assimilation into the greater American society. Creating massive work visa programs or continuing to allow the illegal entry of tens of millions of Hispanics, will result in the Latinization of the entire Southwestern United State into an ethnic, cultural and linguistic extension of Latin America. No matter how I look at that prospect, I seriously doubt that a bilingual, bicultural future for our country, and the inevitable ethnic tensions that would ensue from the long-term demographic inequalities, would be a good thing.

Pete...honestly 10 of millions??? Maybe I'm missing something is it really 10 of millions of illegals???...so again what is different today than in 1986 with President Regan.

Until we AMERICANS stop this and put some thought into what we're doing and what we want (lively hood) illegal immigrants will be a way of life...so being blunt... get over it is all I can really say ...Americans like illegals place burdens on society. However it's us Americans who did this to ourselves...correct statement??????

For me Work visas are the ticket...with strict 'OMG' government oversight/inspection/regulation...but then again we don't want a big government...so we can't have our cake and eat it too....put teeth into it.

I'm surprised if you're neighbor has a known illegal you haven't reported him isn't this your duty??????????. But I understand again it's the jobs folks won't do or don't want to do as they interupt with our lifestyle. Just saying and please don't take offense at not reporting the neighbor...but I think you know what I mean.

k2muskie wrote:

Pete...honestly 10 of millions??? Maybe I'm missing something is it really 10 of millions of illegals???

It's difficult to determine exact numbers since they're undocumented, but the usually agreed-upon figure is somewhere between 10 and 15 million Latin Americans are illegally in this country at the moment. My figure of tens of millions, however, wasn't confined to those currently illegally here. Instead, it was an estimate of what we will have if we open the southern borders to large numbers of work visas, then projecting that figure out into a future population of a Latinized southwest.

My concern isn't so much focused on illegal aliens; instead, it's the large social issues that will result from a demographic shift to a bicultural, bilingual southwestern America as the Hispanic population explodes — largely due to the continuing influx of those illegal immigrants. The Pew Research Center projects that the U.S. Hispanic population, if current trends hold, will expand from 14 percent in 2005 to 29 percent by 2050. That demographic shift will be most prominent in the American southwest where an Hispanic majority (largely Spanish-speaking) will emerge within the next few decades.

So yes, we're talking about tens of millions, and that expansion will have a deep, permanent and ethnically divisive effect on American society.

k2muskie wrote:

...so again what is different today than in 1986 with President Regan.

That's another thread, and one where I've expressed no opinion. My answer, though, is that there's little difference except for the scale.

k2muskie wrote:

Americans like illegals place burdens on society.

I would hope that most American contribute more than they take, otherwise we're in deep trouble.

k2muskie wrote:

However it's us Americans who did this to ourselves...correct statement??????

Yes.

k2muskie wrote:

For me Work visas are the ticket...with strict 'OMG' government oversight/inspection/regulation...but then again we don't want a big government...so we can't have our cake and eat it too....put teeth into it.

Work visas won't solve the problem except for the relatively small number who will be entitled to them under whatever program might be developed. The undocumented workers will still be here and will still be working for peanuts for the employers who don't want the paperwork hassles, regulatory oversight, tax witholdings and minimum wage requirements.

k2muskie wrote:

I'm surprised if you're neighbor has a known illegal you haven't reported him isn't this your duty??????????.

I have no desire to poison the relationship with my next-door neighbor nor be the cause of this poor, old, hard-working man losing what work he's been able to find and being deported back to Mexico. As you've said, we've placed ourselves in this fine predicament, and I'd argue that it's because the federal government, acting on behalf of an apathetic citizenry, hasn't invested enough resources into sealing the southern border to illegal entry over the past 30 years.

Pete wrote:

K2, both Pro and I come from agricultural backgrounds, and we've both seen the first-hand effects and restructuring in the industry that has taken place, partially as a result of illegal workers.

You're right, of course, illegal immigrants perform cut-rate agricultural work, which keeps the costs down of the products they help produce. Without these people doing the work, the employers would need to raise wages and pay more attention to labor conditions and government requirements. Prices would increase significantly for certain products, but I doubt we would see them "skyrocket." Suddenly removing these people from the workforce would cause a significant disruption to an economy and a labor force that has become accustomed to them being there. Some farmers might go out of business; we'd see significantly more imports of these items from, say, Mexico; new agricultural niches would arise; but eventually, it would all balance out in one way or another.

I could argue this issue from any of a half dozen angles, but just to pick an unusual one (for here, anyway) that hasn't been discussed...

From a politically liberal, progressive, social point of view, illegal aliens amount to a highly exploited worker class. The government, over the past 75 years, has put into place a good deal of safeguards to protect workers: safety standards, retirement benefits, public education, labor laws, wage laws, unemployment insurance, and recently, health care. Illegal migrant agricultural workers are cheap to hire because records aren't kept and government rules are ignored.

Just an anecdote, but it exemplifies a larger problem: I have a next-door neighbor who is a rather well-off, retired attorney who is rather fond of placing democratic political signs on his front lawn. He has hired, for about three or four bucks and hour, an older, illegal immigrant worker, whom he refers to as "My Mexican." "My [his] Mexican" mows the lawn twice per week, trims the bushes, plants the flowers, rakes the leaves, washes the windows, shovels snow, cleans the car and does most anything else that he's ordered to do. "My Mexican," since he can't drive and doesn't own a car, sometimes unrolls a sleeping bag in the empty lot next to my neighbors' house where he spends the night. On occasion, my neighbor has volunteered to let me use "My Mexican" to do chores around my house, but I've always declined.

Again, from a politically liberal point of view, these illegal, migrant workers have formed a worker class of untouchables that have fallen between the cracks and that exist in that substandard, second-class netherworld that our, supposedly, socially responsible society has deemed unfit for American citizens. So what is the liberal answer to this problem? A guest worker program, among others. But this post has already gotten too long, so we'll leave the problems associated with that one alone.

Liberal attorney exploiting an illegal. Perfect.

k2muskie wrote:

Argh...I had a great post and my laptop battery died...and as you know you're orginial post will never be recaptured or the same.

Anyhoo...for illegal immigrants the government needs to do something better. These folks I'd wager a vast majority are hard working, law abiding (except for being illegal to America)decent folks basically like you and me and just want to make a living and provide for their families. If it's jobs Americans find beneath them to do so be it. Worker visas should be a priority for this country along with citizenship.

Again Americans did this to themselves with illegal immigrants as basically I've read in Pete's post. Americans for the most part are spoiled and want to live the good life and start out in a job making 75+ grand a year with no training. Wishfull think'n. Again get off your ass and quit blaming illegal immigrants for your own short comings.

Here's something that just recently happened to me.

My sister who I love dearly happened to see a picture of my daughter and her boyfriend on Facebook. Well, my daughters boy friend is Hispanic and an American...my sister doesn't know squat about him but she started yelling and screaming at me on the phone...with words that would make the saltest merchant marine blush...but here's something I know you'd understand she said....he's F**K'n Mexican and they've taken American Jobs. Oh well and the conversation ended.

Now how many of us every day...someone whose not white and/or speaks with broken English do we say to ourselves...they're illegal. Shame on me and you if me and you think this way...shame on all of us. Judge one as to the content of their character and not the color of their skin or broken English...

If illegal immigrants again only crime being they're illegal the government needs to belly up to the bar and provide work visas and eventually citizenship if these folks desire to live in America.

Many say President Regan was the best President this country ever had...but yet in 1986 he granted amnesty for over 2+million illegal immigrants. But no one talks about that factoid. So what is different today...nothing IMHO...we as Americans can't have our cake and eat it too when it comes to illegal immigrants...either do something about your own short comings get skilled or STFU and look at what you can control in your life and your families life and quit rationalizing your failings on someone else...who just happens to maybe work harder than you and will take a job you'd never take...

Oh Pro...didn't you ever hear or watch Johnny Carson in his wizard hat and his Carnac preditions...Carnac is nothing more than someone prediction.

Love ya all...God Bless America and the hard working illegal immigrants who give us the services/products we enjoy every day...too bad many folks have blinders on.

As far as I am concerned K2 those that enter this country illegally have exposed their true character. They are criminals plain and simple regardless of their intentions. Would you defend a bank robber,rapist,or child molester. In my mind there is absolutely no difference. A thief is a thief wether they steal one dollar or 10 million dollars. A criminal is a criminal wether they enter the country illegally or kill someone. In either case they have demonstrated their lack of respect and/or concern for the law and not anyone I would want to have for a neighbor or coworker. I think Pete is right. If we continue to allow illegals enter the country at the rate we have thus far we are headed for a repeat of the race riots in the 60's. Especially with groups like La Raza advocating for hispanics to raise up in violent revolution to retake parts of the U.S. that were once part of Mexico. Only difference I think is if and when this happens it will make the riots of the 60's seem mild.

Yep I'd agree they've committed a crime but to the extent you described their crime of being and in the country illegally equaling that of a murderer, rapist, child molster, etc, etc, etc...well we'll agree to disagree on that one...no comparison IMHO.

So you've never broken the law...no traffic tickets...nothing...you're an 'honest Abe'...come-on...law abiding to the hilt are we...well allrighty then.

k2muskie wrote:

Yep I'd agree they've committed a crime but to the extent you described their crime of being and in the country illegally equaling that of a murderer, rapist, child molster, etc, etc, etc...well we'll agree to disagree on that one...no comparison IMHO.

So you've never broken the law...no traffic tickets...nothing...you're an 'honest Abe'...come-on...law abiding to the hilt are we...well allrighty then.

A criminal is a criminal. When one commits a crime then one owes a debt to society. I never said I have never done anything wrong. I have paid my debt to society,did my time,paid my fines,and completed my probation. I am a citizen and when I chose to do things that went contrary to the written law,society demanded and forced me to pay the debt I owed. I expect society to demand the criminals that enter the country illegally to pay their debt. I never committed a felony in fact all of my crimes were nothing more than drunken bar room brawls in my mind a little less serious than entering the counry illegally. It is incredulous to me there are people that want to just excuse this criminal behavior because they believe the motive for breaking the law is noble.

Yonni wrote:

modern day slavery

fatbass wrote:

Liberal attorney exploits

How is someone receiving an agreed upon wage/goods in exchange for work exploitation or slavery, legal or not? To me, both of these statements are silly.

Following this logic, if someone feels as though they are underpaid they are an exploited slave? Very out of touch and a great example of hyperbole, I hope.

luv2fsh&hnt wrote:

k2muskie wrote:

Argh...I had a great post and my laptop battery died...and as you know you're orginial post will never be recaptured or the same.

Anyhoo...for illegal immigrants the government needs to do something better. These folks I'd wager a vast majority are hard working, law abiding (except for being illegal to America)decent folks basically like you and me and just want to make a living and provide for their families. If it's jobs Americans find beneath them to do so be it. Worker visas should be a priority for this country along with citizenship.

Again Americans did this to themselves with illegal immigrants as basically I've read in Pete's post. Americans for the most part are spoiled and want to live the good life and start out in a job making 75+ grand a year with no training. Wishfull think'n. Again get off your ass and quit blaming illegal immigrants for your own short comings.

Here's something that just recently happened to me.

My sister who I love dearly happened to see a picture of my daughter and her boyfriend on Facebook. Well, my daughters boy friend is Hispanic and an American...my sister doesn't know squat about him but she started yelling and screaming at me on the phone...with words that would make the saltest merchant marine blush...but here's something I know you'd understand she said....he's F**K'n Mexican and they've taken American Jobs. Oh well and the conversation ended.

Now how many of us every day...someone whose not white and/or speaks with broken English do we say to ourselves...they're illegal. Shame on me and you if me and you think this way...shame on all of us. Judge one as to the content of their character and not the color of their skin or broken English...

If illegal immigrants again only crime being they're illegal the government needs to belly up to the bar and provide work visas and eventually citizenship if these folks desire to live in America.

Many say President Regan was the best President this country ever had...but yet in 1986 he granted amnesty for over 2+million illegal immigrants. But no one talks about that factoid. So what is different today...nothing IMHO...we as Americans can't have our cake and eat it too when it comes to illegal immigrants...either do something about your own short comings get skilled or STFU and look at what you can control in your life and your families life and quit rationalizing your failings on someone else...who just happens to maybe work harder than you and will take a job you'd never take...

Oh Pro...didn't you ever hear or watch Johnny Carson in his wizard hat and his Carnac preditions...Carnac is nothing more than someone prediction.

Love ya all...God Bless America and the hard working illegal immigrants who give us the services/products we enjoy every day...too bad many folks have blinders on.

As far as I am concerned K2 those that enter this country illegally have exposed their true character. They are criminals plain and simple regardless of their intentions. Would you defend a bank robber,rapist,or child molester. In my mind there is absolutely no difference. A thief is a thief wether they steal one dollar or 10 million dollars. A criminal is a criminal wether they enter the country illegally or kill someone. In either case they have demonstrated their lack of respect and/or concern for the law and not anyone I would want to have for a neighbor or coworker. I think Pete is right. If we continue to allow illegals enter the country at the rate we have thus far we are headed for a repeat of the race riots in the 60's. Especially with groups like La Raza advocating for hispanics to raise up in violent revolution to retake parts of the U.S. that were once part of Mexico. Only difference I think is if and when this happens it will make the riots of the 60's seem mild.

But you draw the line at drunken bar room brawls? Convenient. So, you've never done anything else illegal that you weren't caught for?

I can just picture you sitting in the middle of the shards of glass that you once called home.

So whats your point FDR? I was arrested and I paid my debt to society. How is entering the country illegally any less of a crime or more excusable than me smacking some wise ass prick for mouthing off. Why shouldn't they pay the consequences of their choice to violate the law?

k2muskie wrote:

Argh...I had a great post and my laptop battery died...and as you know you're orginial post will never be recaptured or the same. Been there, done that way too many times.

Anyhoo...for illegal immigrants the government needs to do something better. These folks I'd wager a vast majority are hard working, law abiding (except for being illegal to America)decent folks basically like you and me and just want to make a living and provide for their families. If it's jobs Americans find beneath them to do so be it. Worker visas should be a priority for this country along with citizenship. I have no doubt most illegals are hard working folks, but again it is dishonest to say their 'only' crime is being here illegally. They commit fraud with doctored SSN's, they steal people's SSN's (usually minors) that cause havoc for those individuals when they attempt to use their SSN and/or credit rating. There is a huge black market for fake ID's, stolen SSN's, fake visa's. It is extremely naive to believe their 'only' crime is coming here illegally.

Again Americans did this to themselves with illegal immigrants as basically I've read in Pete's post. Americans for the most part are spoiled and want to live the good life and start out in a job making 75+ grand a year with no training. Wishfull think'n. Again get off your ass and quit blaming illegal immigrants for your own short comings. I agree, Americans are spoiled, they expect/demand either high paying jobs on day one, or they expect/demand entitlements from the government. The 'new' generation is taught to have this mindset from an early age. No keeping score at youth sporting events, no valedictorians at graduations to avoid 'hurt' feelings, etc, etc.

Here's something that just recently happened to me.

My sister who I love dearly happened to see a picture of my daughter and her boyfriend on Facebook. Well, my daughters boy friend is Hispanic and an American...my sister doesn't know squat about him but she started yelling and screaming at me on the phone...with words that would make the saltest merchant marine blush...but here's something I know you'd understand she said....he's F**K'n Mexican and they've taken American Jobs. Oh well and the conversation ended.

Now how many of us every day...someone whose not white and/or speaks with broken English do we say to ourselves...they're illegal. Shame on me and you if me and you think this way...shame on all of us. Judge one as to the content of their character and not the color of their skin or broken English... Once again I agree. I have many friends that are Hispanic, hell my step-daughters' last name is Gallegos. I don't blame people wanting to come here for a better life, but they MUST obey the laws or they are a hindrance to the society, no matter how hard working they are. It is impossible for a nation to be free without laws, and laws are of no benefit if they are ignored. I do NOT care what color ones skin is, but I DO care of they are here illegally or not. I promise you I would turn Pete's neighbor in a New York minute. Turning away and knowingly allowing such contempt of the law is part of the problem! Apathy is not how this country returns to greatness.

If illegal immigrants again only crime being they're illegal the government needs to belly up to the bar and provide work visas and eventually citizenship if these folks desire to live in America. Again, they are guilty are far more than just crossing the border w/o permission.

Many say President Regan was the best President this country ever had...but yet in 1986 he granted amnesty for over 2+million illegal immigrants. But no one talks about that factoid. So what is different today...nothing IMHO...we as Americans can't have our cake and eat it too when it comes to illegal immigrants...either do something about your own short comings get skilled or STFU and look at what you can control in your life and your families life and quit rationalizing your failings on someone else...who just happens to maybe work harder than you and will take a job you'd never take... IMHO, this was the dumbest thing Reagan did. I ask, those that point to Reagan's amnesty as justification for amnesty now: did it solve things or make the illegal immigration problem worse? The answer is clear, there were 2 million illegals here in 1986, today there are over 20 million illegals. So, the government made the problem TEN TIMES WORSE, and the progressive solution is to double down? Pure insanity!

Oh Pro...didn't you ever hear or watch Johnny Carson in his wizard hat and his Carnac preditions...Carnac is nothing more than someone prediction. Must confess I am not familiar with this.

Love ya all...God Bless America and the hard working illegal immigrants who give us the services/products we enjoy every day...too bad many folks have blinders on.

I grew up on a farm, in a small farming community. Some of the farms employed illegal workers, as did the local turkey operations. My grandpa and dad never hired illegals because they had cheaper labor, me and my cousins. Every now and then the government would do raids and round up the illegals and send them back to Mexico, most of them would be back within two weeks. It was no where near as big of a problem back in the 80's it is today. There are ten times as many illegals in America today than back then. Add in the drug element intertwined with the illegal immigration issue and we have a recipe for disaster. k2, you say God bless "the hard working illegal immigrants". I say shame on those who exploit these illegals and use them as slave labor and shame on those who condone such behavior.